Remington's Model 798 and 799 Rifle... [Archive] - Varmints Den

: Remington's Model 798 and 799 Rifle...


John
12-30-2006, 08:36 AM
Mike and I stopped by Gunmasters, a local gun store in Plano, TX yesterday and got a chance to fondle Remington's model 798 in .308. It's a very fine looking rifle with nicely finished wood and deep blued finish.

The lure of this rifle is the action and it's similarity to the much touted Model 98 Mauser. The only one they had in stock was the 798, which is the heavier calibers like 243, 308, 30-06, etc. The model 799 includes the 22 Hornet, 222, 22-250, 223 and 7.62x39.

While the appearance and feel is excellent, the bolt dragged a bit, even though there was a liberal amount of grease on it. Having zero experience with an actual Mauser action I don't know if this is normal or not. The similarity of the Ruger action to the Mauser however is significant and the Ruger is much smoother to work than the 798. (Perhaps because I'm comparing a 223 Ruger to a 798 action in 308 .)

I look forward to hearing about the real world accuracy and performance of this line of rifles.

You can read the details on this rifle on Remingtons Web Site (http://www.remington.com/products/firearms/centerfire_rifles/model_799.asp).

http://www.remington.com/images/products/firearms/centerfire/lgsil_799.jpg

Sonny Pruitt
12-30-2006, 09:59 AM
I held one here at Green Top Sporting Goods in Richmond VA. Yes, you are right about the action, drag wasn't the right word to describe this one, "STIFF" and nearly locked up would be better terms. This one was the Model 799 in 223 caliber and the bolt head was so tiny, I was afraid I was gonna break it trying to operate the action.

They are pretty and a real apple to the eye. Wish I had one in 222, but gotta do something about that action first.

Terry N.
12-30-2006, 11:22 AM
I have two of the Whitworth rifles, which were imported by Interarms before the recent troubles in the Balkans; one is a .308 Mannlicher carbine and the other started out life as a .30-06 and I had it rebarreled to .35 Whelen.

Both are very nice hunting rigs, and the Whelen is scary accurate with it's Shilen barrel. I call it my 'bang-plop' gun! The .308 Mannlicher is much older - probably dating to the '50s, and isn't quite as accurate as the Whelen. The Mannlicher came with an external adjustment Bausch & Lomb scope and mount! It's still one of my favorite deer rifles.

Ole
12-30-2006, 12:07 PM
I bought a 799 in.222 awhile back and the bolt travel sucked, trigger pull was also very heavy. But, I played around with things, I won't say what because I wanna stay outta trouble, but I got the bolt travel to where it ain't bad at all and the trigger pull came way down to. I like the rifle, pretty stock, nicely finished barreled action, kinda feels like a toy, put Warne rings and bases on it plus a V16 Weaver. Now I just have to wait for warmer weather up here.....Tom

Bayou City Boy
12-30-2006, 01:58 PM
The actions are actually the same as the old Interarms Mark X Mauser imported from Yugoslavia, and later the Charles Daly imports following the lifting of the US State Department arms embargo on Yugoslavia as a result of the Bosnian War of the late 1980's early 1990's. Apparently Remington recently gave ZCZ (no relationship to CZ) a better deal than Charles Daly was giving them.

They are made in the Zastava Arsenal (Zavodi Crventa Zastava) in old Yugo., and the actions have "sloppy" bolt travel by design. Peter Paul Mauser built the 98 action with additonal clearances so they would operate well in dirty, muddy, military battlefield conditions. Many parts interchange between the commercial action and the original military 98 Mauser actions.

If you operate the actions fairly briskly, they work pretty well and will smooth up after use - just like PP Mauser wanted them to function.

My first CF bolt action rifle was one of the Interarms Mark X Mauser rifles in 7MM Rem Mag that I bought in the early 1970's. It was a very good shooter, and I wish at times that I still owned it.

HTH - BCB

LanceInOregon
12-30-2006, 04:39 PM
I did some checking, and these guns are priced right about what it would cost for you to get a comparable rifle from CZ . CZ offers a great controlled feed action, and they have an excellent reputation for both quality and accuracy. I cannot imagine that these Yugo imported Remington's can look better than a CZ, either. I have seen some really handsome CZ rifles in stores.

Anyway, my advice for you is to start looking at CZ's, if this type of action intrigues you. There is a reason why they have developed such a strong following here in the USA in recent years.

If you want to buy a Remington, then buy a real American made Model 700. A 700 SPS would certainly cost no more. Spend another $200 and you could even get a 700 LV SF, and have a really great varmint rifle.

Anyway, that is my feelings on these rifles. I doubt Remington will continue to offer them for very long.

Lance in Orygun

LanceInOregon
12-30-2006, 04:46 PM
Look at this Deluxe grade .223 CZ 527 currently for sale on Gunbroker.com:

Lance in Orygun

http://nas4.atlanta.gbhinc.com/GB/063220000/63220395/pix3046274611.jpg

LanceInOregon
12-30-2006, 04:52 PM
I've never heard of this CZ model before. It looks absolutely awesome!

Here is a link to one on sale on gunbroker.com:

http://gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.asp?Item=63185589

It sure looks like one fine firearm for $599

Alas, though, I already own THREE .223 rifles! So I will have to pass -- :D

Lance in Oregon

C Miller
12-30-2006, 05:49 PM
Did I read it right that the small actions are going to be actually push feeds with a M16 type extractor? Frankly I can't wait to see one of their Hornets for a 17AH project without having to pay someone to cut the mag down on the 527. I own a couple of 527's and to this day I still don't like clip fed centerfires, especially ones that hang down. I hope the Hornet version works as good as it looks.

John
12-30-2006, 07:24 PM
He brought his CZ American in 223 and I had my 221 Fireball. We each fired a few rounds from each and came to the same conclusion. While the CZ is a really accurate and great rifle and neither of us would part with ours, the action is rough. Although not as bad as the Rem 798 we tried, they are still not as smooth as the Ruger much less a Rem 700. That may not bother some folks but in a target rich environment with the adrenalin running high, I don't have time to wrestle a cartridge into a chamber.

While I can't speak for Mike on what he wants next, I'm pretty sure mine won't be either a CZ or 798/799. At the moment I'm leaning towards a Lilja barreled 700 in either 22-250 or some variant of the 17 family. Then again, Alex Clarke can be blamed for leaving this gnawing bug about Coopers in the back of my head.

LanceInOregon
12-30-2006, 10:20 PM
then I would recommend checking out Browning's Varmint Stalker. The Browning A-Bolt action is about as smooth and slick as can be. Its short 60 degree bolt lift allows for real fast operation of the action. They are so reliable in feeding, too.

It is not hard to tweak A-Bolt triggers down to a nice pull, too. And the Varmint Stalker model only weighs 7 lbs 13 oz in .223 or .204, making for a nice compromise in weight between a walking varminter and a full blown bull barrel model. The .22-250 model Varmint Stalker weighs 8 lbs 3 oz, because it has a 26 in barrel, instead of 24 inch.

I shopped around and was a able to pick one up locally in .204 Ruger a few moths ago for only $675

Here is one on Gun Broker for even less:

http://gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.asp?Item=63083720

The A-Bolt action is really hard to beat, in my opinion. Maybe one could argue that the Sako model 75 or 85 actions are superior. But then you are looking at prices up close to a Cooper.

Lance

Ole
12-31-2006, 12:38 PM
Had one of those, weird feeling stock. I like the Rem XR-100 in .204.

LanceInOregon
12-31-2006, 07:17 PM
Had one of those, weird feeling stock. I like the Rem XR-100 in .204.

Except the discussion here focused on having a fast, slick, action, that would allow for rapid fire in a varmint rich environment.

A single shot rifle hardly would fit that. And the X-100 is even more heavy than a 700 VSSF to carry into the field.

Lance in Orygun

Bruce Herndon
01-01-2007, 02:41 PM
The slickest action I have ever seen on a factory production rifle has to be the old Colt Sauer's. You could open the bolt on any of those, hold the rifle by the butt and the forearm, tilt it down and up or sling it back and forth and the bolt would glide effortlessly.

Ole
01-01-2007, 03:28 PM
Except the discussion here focused on having a fast, slick, action, that would allow for rapid fire in a varmint rich environment.

A single shot rifle hardly would fit that. And the X-100 is even more heavy than a 700 VSSF to carry into the field.

Lance in Orygun

"Rapid fire in a varmint rich enviroment" with a light barreled rifle?? Single shot is a good idea, takes a little time to reload, save the barrel. If your hell-bent or rapid fire then an AR is the rifle to get, why would you waste your time with a bolt action, doesn't make sense, at least to me.

1badshee
01-01-2007, 03:57 PM
What's everyones opinions on the tikka's? Ive been looking at them for a new rifle.

willbird
02-08-2008, 06:25 PM
Does anybody have a picture of the 799 bolt from the front end ??

One neat thing about them over the CZ is that they do a 22-250 on the mini mauser action which CZ does not appear to do ?? I want to know what type of EJECTOR the 799 uses, is it a typical mauser type ?? Or is a rem 700 type plunger ??

Bill

bcp
02-08-2008, 06:52 PM
From:
http://www.rifleshootermag.com/featured_rifles/rem798_091406/index1.html

http://www.rifleshootermag.com/featured_rifles/RSmauser_091406C.jpg

798 is left bolt, 799 is right bolt. Looks like they both use the classic Mauser slotted-lug blade ejector.

Bruce

Larry D Scott
02-09-2008, 02:41 AM
I dont have a JEWELL trigger to fit a Cooper !!!!

Bigrock
02-09-2008, 05:00 AM
He brought his CZ American in 223 and I had my 221 Fireball. We each fired a few rounds from each and came to the same conclusion. While the CZ is a really accurate and great rifle and neither of us would part with ours, the action is rough. Although not as bad as the Rem 798 we tried, they are still not as smooth as the Ruger much less a Rem 700. That may not bother some folks but in a target rich environment with the adrenalin running high, I don't have time to wrestle a cartridge into a chamber.

While I can't speak for Mike on what he wants next, I'm pretty sure mine won't be either a CZ or 798/799. At the moment I'm leaning towards a Lilja barreled 700 in either 22-250 or some variant of the 17 family. Then again, Alex Clarke can be blamed for leaving this gnawing bug about Coopers in the back of my head.

John if you like a smooth action try a Sako L 579 I just got one in 22-250 smooth as glass.
Try a older Mauser action.I have 3 98's and a Swede I think you will see the differance in them and the Remington imports

Good shooting
Kenny

Alex
02-09-2008, 10:05 AM
... that the Brown sleigh brought yesterday, the bug would become a alligator! :)

Alex

papapaul
02-10-2008, 10:16 AM
So, about 20 years ago, I had this Mini Mark X in .223. 200 yards across a pasture from my bedroom window was a wooden fence, just where the woods started. Crows would sit on the fence and I had shot 4 or 5. One morning, just after the school bus left, I saw a crow on the fence and shot it. A miracle happened, it flew up into a tree. I saw black up in the tree and shot again. It fell out of the tree, but as it fell end over end, it looked like a cat. Our cat. The crow must have flown past it. How it got up into a tree 250 yards above the house so quickly I don't know. It usually went out when the kids left for the bus. Whell cats didn't last too long around our place anyway, but it was an unusual.

YoteSmoker
02-10-2008, 09:03 PM
Despite 5 negative points for not knowing your intended target, you are awarded 10 cool points for taking out one more cat plus an additional 10 bonus points for taking out your own cat. Now, did you have to tell your family their cat ran away or flew away?

papapaul
02-14-2008, 08:47 AM
The 799 in 7.62x39 would make a pretty nice deer gun for a kid. Or the CZ 527 for that matter. My first deer gun was a 20ga single shot.

amafrank
03-02-2008, 08:22 PM
I bought a 799 in .223 and pulled the barrel to do some custom work. I used a PacNor blank to make a 16.5" suppressed tensioned barrel. The barrel has a 3 groove 1 in 7.5" twist so it can handle long heavy bullets like the 240gr Sierra Matchkings. Accuracy of the round is excellent with guys shooting 1" or better groups at 100yd. Most report 1/2" or better but I'd like to see that before making such a statement. The round is right up there with 30-30 or 7.62X39 with 125gr to 150 gr bullets and is capable of shooting the heavy bullets up to 240gr both subsonic or supersonic. 240gr at 1300+FPS is pretty good and right up there with 44mag energy wise.

The rifle does have a draggy bolt and a heavy trigger as some have stated but the bolt does improve with use. I'm sure it could be worked to smoothness. The factory trigger is adjustable and I was able to get the pull down on mine to a very nice level. I was a little disappointed in the fact that this receiver unlike the full size 98 action, does not have two breeching shoulders for the barrel. I decided to do a tensioned barrel to prevent the barrel from "wobbling" and also to keep the effects of heat from changing the point of impact. The action is a nice one and the laminated stock is much better looking and feeling when compared to the current plastic stuff in this price range. I built this one from the ground up with the intent of suppressing it so the sleeve used to tension the barrel doubles as an expansion chamber when the suppressor is installed. The suppressor vents high pressure gasses into the sleeve and this helps cut the sound level down even more than with just the suppressor. The suppressor is removable because it is not legal in many states to hunt game animals with them installed. Most states do allow their use against varmints and pest species though. Here are a couple pics, one with the can installed and one without.

http://i149.photobucket.com/albums/s71/amafrank/799finishedrightwithcan.jpg

http://i149.photobucket.com/albums/s71/amafrank/799finishedrightcanoff.jpg

I haven't had a chance to shoot much in the way of groups yet. We discovered the scope had some problems when we tried sighting it in. We did fire a few varied types of bullets from 150gr all the way up to 240gr both subsonic and supersonic. The subs are very quiet and you can hear them hissing in flight as well as smacking the target. The supersonic loads shoot flatter as you would expect but are much louder due to the sonic boom the bullet makes as it flies. The rifle is still quiet but the shooter hears a loud crack coming from the target area. Its much more pleasant to shoot with no earplugs.
Having just built a 700 in 300 whisper I'd have to say the 799 is ahead in popularity with any of the shooters so far. The 700 ejector system sucks and quick followup shots are not possible when the empty is dropped in the receiver. The 799 on the other hand is typical mauser type and can pitch the empties 20ft if you yank the bolt back hard enough. The extractor is more like the older 91 mauser being a spring type fitted into the outside of the bolt.
Thats about it for now.
Hope this isn't too long a post for a new guy. Just thought I'd toss my 2 cents in since I have recent first hand experience with the rifles.

Frank

Rick in Oregon
03-03-2008, 11:45 AM
John, I know Alex Clarke can be hard on the bank account too. His enthusiasm can be infectious with his love for the small calibers in cool little rifles.

For your 17 project considerations, without breaking the bank for a nice Cooper, here's what I did, although in hind sight, either/both could have been Cooper's for almost the same cash outlay.

For a 17 Ackley Hornet, I built up an old Ruger No.3 I had laying around. Pac-Nor Super Match 22" barrel and a Bell & Carlson stock for a No.1. Shoots bugholes with the 20 V-Max behind AA1680 at 3810 fps. Pure ground squirrel death, and one of the most "fun" rifles in my safe.

http://i53.photobucket.com/albums/g66/packrat1/P1010014-2.jpg

For a 17 Mach IV, an old Sako L461 Vixen action, Shilen barrel, and an "on sale" McMillan stock. Skippy hates this one too, as it launches 25 grain Bergers at 3880 fps, and is good on squirrels out to 400 yards. The action is almost a Mauser, very slick, feeds excellent, and with the Canjar set trigger, is a pure joy to shoot either from the bench or from sticks/bipod. I've used the little Vixen action for a couple of other varmint rifles, and really have a soft spot for them.

http://i53.photobucket.com/albums/g66/packrat1/P5061836.jpg

There's always the neat feeling of bringing a new rifle home from the gun shop, but the satisfaction of completing a semi-custom rifle may actually top it, as the semi-custom job is tailored to you, in your caliber of choice, and the guy on the next bench doesn't have one just like it...... Just something to consider for your 17 caliber project. :)

ThJudg
03-08-2008, 12:39 PM
My brother bought a 798 in .30-06 this past fall, and it was all of the things previously mentioned. The action was absolutely terrible, and it took a good gunsmith quite a while, and some machining, to make the trigger pull tolerable.
I would not buy one what-so-ever, and despite the fact that we all expect different qualities out of our guns, I don't think there is a better rifle for the money than the CZ's. They are not Custom or Semi-Custom rifles, but for something off the shelf that shoots good, has great wood, and the average guy can afford, they are hard to beat.

ThJudg (Roger)

amafrank
03-13-2008, 11:17 AM
My brother bought a 798 in .30-06 this past fall, and it was all of the things previously mentioned. The action was absolutely terrible, and it took a good gunsmith quite a while, and some machining, to make the trigger pull tolerable.
ThJudg (Roger)

I'm a bit surprised at this since the guns come with an adjustable trigger. I tweaked my 799 a bit and got the pull down to 2 pounds reliably with nice feel. I thought the 798's used the same trigger....? I did need to do a bit of polishing on the bolt to smooth things out but its nice now. I've not dealt with the CZ's so I can't compare.....

Frank