Hbn
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I've been a fan of tungsten disulphide as a coating for over 20 years now. This was after some near ruinous experiences with "Moly" coatings.
I experimented with different coatings (including 'MOLY'), but after switching to tungsten and experiencing group stability in excess of 75 rounds (competition accuracy) between cleanings, I stopped looking for anything else.
But, I like to keep an open mind. So, I'd be interested to hear how the tungsten and the Hbn compare in terms of
shots between cleanings,
preferred pre-treatment (if any),
ease of application(!) and
ease of cleaning (comparisons).
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I experimented with different coatings (including 'MOLY'), but after switching to tungsten and experiencing group stability in excess of 75 rounds (competition accuracy) between cleanings, I stopped looking for anything else.
But, I like to keep an open mind. So, I'd be interested to hear how the tungsten and the Hbn compare in terms of
shots between cleanings,
preferred pre-treatment (if any),
ease of application(!) and
ease of cleaning (comparisons).
.
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HbN
Thanks for the reply Paul. I too have been using WS2 as a bullet coating for several years. I don't do a lot of high volume fire. I do want the first shot at a distant groundhog to go where I expect it to. The only knock I have on WS2 is that it can get messy. The coating can be polished up with a cloth but it fades to a matte finish after a while.
I have bought some copper coated BBs and ordered some HbN from Derby Dust. https://www.derbydust.com/shop/reloading-hex-boron-nitride-hbn-powder/
I will give a report after I get a chance to use it.
Thanks for the reply Paul. I too have been using WS2 as a bullet coating for several years. I don't do a lot of high volume fire. I do want the first shot at a distant groundhog to go where I expect it to. The only knock I have on WS2 is that it can get messy. The coating can be polished up with a cloth but it fades to a matte finish after a while.
I have bought some copper coated BBs and ordered some HbN from Derby Dust. https://www.derbydust.com/shop/reloading-hex-boron-nitride-hbn-powder/
I will give a report after I get a chance to use it.
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Not having experience w/ hbn, but I have with Moly and WS2. So, I wonder of the only difference between WS2 and hbn is the COLOR of the MESS?
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We've been buying the HBN kit from Tubbs. Comes with kit, and easy to follow instructions. Cost is around 50-60 Dollars and it will coat a couple thousand depending upon what size bullets you're using it on. It's clean,and haven't had to change the load any. Clean up on the barrel is slightly easier.
The only tweak we did was to not use the rubbing alcohol to clean the bullets prior to coating. Most rubbing alcohol has 5-10% water in it and trying to completely dry them after cleaning with alcohol-water can be a real challenge.
We use acetone for the initial clean up. It does a much better job cleaning and dries quickly and evenly with a little sunshine and a breeze. While we like using hbn, I would caution anyone using it about it going exactly to point of aim on the first shot every time after cleaning..... I've seen maybe 3(?) shots go to as much as 3-4" off point of aim at 100yds on the first shot from a cleaned barrel. MUCH better than moly, but I can't compare it with WS2 as I have no first hand experience with it. WD
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If it’s competition shooting or hunting, IMHO you want to foul the barrel with about 3 shots o settle it in. In has been my experence that be it naked bullets, moly or danzac it takes three shots to settle them in an start shooting accurately.i’ve never used boron so I can’t comment on clean barrel accuracy. But years ago when I started shooting and long before all these high tech coatings cane about, I was taught that consistent accuracy required a slightly fouled barrel. That’s my 2 cents worth.
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Onehole: That's been my experience too, far as "fouler shots" go (with WS2 (aka Danzac): the 3rd or 4th shot was always back in the group with any of the rifles I shoot when using WS2 AND pre-treatment with a swab wetted with LocEase (sp?).
Cleanup (the MAJOR ADVANTAGE) with WS2 is a breeze compared to Moly. (In fact I had some REAL ISSUES with moly that never cropped up with tungsten.)
I don't know about boron, but with the WS2 I tumbled the blts in a pill bottle required the slightest amount of the stuff (one CC was ample for 100 .224 bullets).
Then after coating, using a wide mouth funnel and a flower sifter I was able to separate the blts from the left over dust. Then with a (foot square) piece of terrycloth towel and a back and forth "wire saw" action, the bullets come out shiny wiith very little getting on my fingers as I placed them on the cases, ready to be seated. (It washes off easily with a little dishwashing detergent and water.)
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I have used it for several years. It seems to work great for my application which is mostly in the PD. fields. I shoot match grade barrels in most. I doesn't seem to work quite as well in rough factory barrels such as Savage until you get the chatter marks smoothed out. This is my process for coating them.
Clean bare bullets with acetone as mentioned above.
I put them in a toaster oven set at 150 to 170 degrees for about 15 min.
drop them in a pill bottle filled with steel shot and HBN right out of the oven.
Tape the lid shut with electric tape put them in a tumbler for 1 to 2 hours.
Take them out and put them in a wool sock and shake them back and forth for about a min. to get the excess off. Put them in a plastic ziplock samwich bag and back in the box they came out of. redy to load.
I can shoot up to 100 rds. without cleaning barrels with no noticeable accuracy loss.
Good stuff in my opinion.
Clean bare bullets with acetone as mentioned above.
I put them in a toaster oven set at 150 to 170 degrees for about 15 min.
drop them in a pill bottle filled with steel shot and HBN right out of the oven.
Tape the lid shut with electric tape put them in a tumbler for 1 to 2 hours.
Take them out and put them in a wool sock and shake them back and forth for about a min. to get the excess off. Put them in a plastic ziplock samwich bag and back in the box they came out of. redy to load.
I can shoot up to 100 rds. without cleaning barrels with no noticeable accuracy loss.
Good stuff in my opinion.
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YUP...
That's essentially what I would say about the process and the results with tungsten (aka Danzac).
The only exception would be that I use the (tri-chloral type) automotive BRAKE CLEANER to degrease the bare bullets laid on a terry cloth towel, and then rolled back and forth to first degrease them before tumbling. After tumbling/coating, I lay them on a clean towel and with a back and forth motion remove any excess powder and polish the bullets. NO toaster oven needed, minimal waste or mess.!
Rick Fox told me too that at some of his BR matches, it is common to run as many as 100 rounds between barrel cleaning, w/o loss of accuracy.
Far as mess goes, there really isn't any that get's away. I get skilled (trial and error) at estimating how much powder to put in the pill bottle and bullets to coat the bullets fully w/o wasting any. AND, dumping the bottle of bullets into a flower sifter held over the funnel gets most of the excess (recovered), so there is even less that rubs off on the towel.
Sounds like it boils down to $$ and availability of the base materials. It has been a while, because the stuff goes so far(!), but there are several industrial supply outlets that sell the WS2 in 5 micron size (some say is ideal for bullet coating: seems so). So, is one limited to TUBB as a sole supplier, or is the hbn powder available at industrial supply stores, do you know? (T'would be good to know...)
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Particle size is important, Some if not most of the supply stores have a range or bell curve of particle size and I guess we're just chicken to order and get the wrong particle size from the industrial supply stores so we just order it from Tubb. This is on the HBN. WD
I have used nearly a pound of both diameters of HBN. I cannot notice any difference. I load from.17 Fireball to 300 Ultra Mag. I believe there might be more advantage to the larger diameter because it might be more space between the barrel and the bullet. I have not tried zinc coated BBs . I use steel waterfowl shot. I have tried both 6 and 4 shot. I like the smaller 6s. A bag of 6s will last forever. I am tumbling the new .224 Berger 85.5 Hybrids as we speak.
No naked bullets. I shoot only coated bullets. Barrels heat up slower, last longer, the first shot out of a clean barrel lands next to the next four. The "Combined Technology" coating was a good one as well.
No naked bullets. I shoot only coated bullets. Barrels heat up slower, last longer, the first shot out of a clean barrel lands next to the next four. The "Combined Technology" coating was a good one as well.
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