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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hello everyone, I have been reading everyones posts, looking at pictures, and checking the classifieds religiously for about the last month. I think this is a really cool site and very nice how everyone helps out and give input back and forth.
I am very excited and I am putting together my first target/varmint rifle and have done alot of research and just ordered a Savage 12 Long Range Precision Varminter in Ruger .204 today!!!
My question is on the Burris Sig. Sel. 8x32 and 6x24 scopes and what you guys think about thier quality. Which one would i like more for shooting prairie dogs and at paper. I would like all of your opinions on the 2 diff. powers and on the different reticles you guys like. I am leaning towards a 8-32 in Mil Dot just so i have the extra power and never wish i had the extra(if i did get the 6x24). Do any of you have a newer nice one for sale(8x32 preferibly or a 6x24)??? Also is the Sig. Sel. a better scope than the Fullfield II??

Thank you very much for your time and hope to chat w/ you all soon!
 

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In my opinion, Mil-Dots are for "tactical" shooting and are very poor for either target shooting or especially PD shooting as they cover up too much of the target / varmint.

I tried one several years ago PD hunting and thank goodness I took 3 other rifles.... the mil-dots totally obscured the PD's past about 250yds..
 

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Go to

board sponser The Optic Zone and look at all of them. Personally, I think 8 power on the low end will not be low enough in many instances, sometimes 6 is too much, but it is better. Right now I am enamored with Nikons and have 2 of the 6-20's. Plenty of scope for anything you'd want to do.


Molon Labe

Kim
 

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The Signature Select.

Is the next grade higher than the Fullfield two.. I also encourage you to scrutinize the Bushnell Elite 4200, and Nikon Monarch scopes. I have several of each and I feel they are better scopes than a Burris. I dont think you would like a Mil-dot for what you are planning. I personally would encourage you to get a fine cross-hair or a 1/8 min. Target Dot reticle. Either of these would be far better than a "busy" mil-dot. Check our board sponser Opticzone for best prices. I have bought several scopes from them and they have been fast and good to deal with. They are almost always the best priced on the net as well. Later..T.
 

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I have to respectfully disagree with a couple of the posters, ref: mildots. I shot a regular crosshair, and a fine cross-hair with dot the first couple of years on pd's. Maybe my "ageing eyes" caught up with me, but I'm sold on the mildot reticles. I have been shooting a Bushnell 3200, 7x21, mildot the last couple of years, and won't shoot anything else. You need to shoot your rifle at distances, and make a chart on your drops at respective distances. If you know your shooting distances and know where to aim ref: on your reticle, you only have to worry about the wind. The mildots are designed to work at a particular magnification, on my scope at 14x. You would also have to chart your drops everytime you change the magnification. It may not be significant enough to miss a pd, but you would need to know how much it would change. I've also never had a mildot "cover-up" a pd, at any range. To me, knowing where to put a mildot on a target is much more reliable than having to "guess" how high to aim. Mildots may not work for you, but they work fine for me.
 

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Signature Select

I have a SS scope. IMO it is a fine scope. However there are alot of good scopes out there in that price range. But if you like the SS, it would be a fine choice. Reticles are a matter of opinion. As far as the power is concerned, I have found anything above 16X to not be of much use in a hunting situation. It can be nice at the bench?? But I do not think anything higher is practical in the field?? I like to hunt at the power that I practice at-so the 6X24 would be the highest I would go. 6.5X20's do just fine. My favorite Varmint scope is a straight 16X Leupold. I must admit-my effective hunting limit(90% Hits) is about 350 yards. We just built a new 540 yard range I am trying to up my effective hunting range to that distance. I have found 16X to be enough power for 540, by my skills are not there yet. Tom.
 

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Ditto this on the mil-dots, also rarely do I exceed 12X, totally unnecessary
 

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I have a whole bunch of Burris scopes and wouldn't sell any of them. The Signatures are all pre-select models. They're rugged scopes with good optics. I haven't used the Signature Select.

For prairie dogs - rockchucks - groundsquirrels, those guns have 6-24 or 8-32 power scopes. The 8-32's aren't too powerful and the whole 32X is used everytime out unless the scope will only go to 24X and in that case the whole 24X is used everytime out. With small targets the limiting factor is muzzle jump. With a gun that has little or no recoil / muzzle rise, you'll use the power if you have it.....and you'll really like having it. And for shooting paper, you're looking at bullet holes and power is good.

About a mildot reticle.....it's "tactical" and all that, so it must be trick and really good, right? But it's about the worst pd / varmint reticle you could choose. It's purpose is for use on human scaled targets like jeeps or trucks or generators or....humans. Not small crawling creatures. One mil=3.6" at 100yds. Think about how big that is out at off-fur distances where you'd actually need rangefinding. Even if the dot were 1/2mil, that's still enormous and at a few hundred yards would just about cover a whole small (pd) target. Just because it works for a military or police sniper doesn't mean it's right for shooting varmints. One of my Burris scopes has a ballistic mildot reticle and the small crosshatches below center work really well....the mildots are superfluous. A fine crosshair works really well and so does the ballistic plex.
 

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Just Commenting on Magnification for Pd's

I use 6x20 & 6.5x24, in the field on the dogs ,I have then turned down to 16x. Anything higher then that will tend to make the critter look like a big & easy target, and misses increase. In the past 5 yrs ,since moving to WY, have been shooting 2500+ Pd's per season, fm my War Wagon [64 Scout with wind shield Removed] that total includes friends & fellow shooters from GGVG that stop by. I started out at Max power & found that 16x is the optimum for the best Kill Ratio. At the bench for load development crank it up to Max. My 2¢. Russ.
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
Thanks guys!

Thank you for all the info guys. You all gave me a lot to think about and i think it will help me push in the right direction. I am still leaning towards the Burris b/c of the lifetime warranty(as a Leupold does) but at a significant price difference. My next question is what type of rings should i buy to stick it on my Savage LR Precision Varminter?? Thanks for all your help guys!!!
 

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My next question is what type of rings should i buy to stick it on my Savage LR Precision Varminter?? Thanks for all your help guys!!!
My choice would be the Burris insert rings - no lapping or epoxy bedding is required. As a matter of routine, I JB Weld the bases to the receiver. I find it ended any tendancy to have the base screws get loose, and the zero seems to be stabilized as there is no 'cold flowing' of the metals under stress of recoil.

I have the Burris SS in an 8x32 and it is a very nice scope so far. I do experience a little loss of contrast near the 32x setting. However, the EW knobs seem to be repeatable and do not display any "loss of motion" when running the settings up and down, right and left of zero.

I like the duplex crosshairs for quickly correcting POI errors due to range or wind estimate error. If the POI can be found after the miss, it can be eyeball referenced relative to the duplex for a quick follow-up shot. And, knowing how many clicks it is between the intersection and the duplex (thicker part) begins, one can easily "click" the changes in, if that be your preference.

Someone said higher magnification resulted in more misses...I have to wonder if his zero is drifting with magnification - something NOT very desireable, to be sure, and something variable power scope manufactures try very hard to avoid. Some manufactures are better at achieving a stable POI with magnification change than others. So far, I haven't noticed any POI shift of consequence in my Burris SigSelect - mainly because I don't change power that often, I suppose.

Lots of folks say stuff like 16x "is high enough". Mebby for their eyes, but I can't kill what I can't see. Besides, one can always turn magnification down to 16x, but ya can't turn it up if that is the limit. A PD sitting on a mound at 650 yards away where the shooter is facing into the sun so he is backlit (as photographers say), you will appreciate the higher magnification.

Ol Ackman and I don't always agree ;) but on more magnification being better (as a rule), we agree - especially when the critters are small and distance is "challenging"! (How 'bout that, sports fans??? :D )

Truth be known...I've had the Burris 8x32 SS for a couple years (almost), but for absolute image purity my eyes like the Leupold 6.5x20 better. The only scope that I'd place above the Leu for image and function would be the Nightforce scopes. (Scope functions are more important than image quality, IMO. After all, I'm not taking their picture. But, I want those crosshairs to "click" when I tell them to, and the image better be in focus - not to be confused with "contrast" which is a different thing.)

I have the Nikon Titanium which is pricy unit based on the Monarch. It is excellent, so the many recommendations for the Monarch 6x20 (24?) does not surprise me. I also have the Weaver V24 which is a terrific scope in all aspects except for image contrast, especially above 20x. But, unless I'm shooting directly into the sun, a sunshade cures 95% of the contrast issues. Mine has proven very reliable on a half dozen rifles and has the added feature of being able to focus down to 20 yards if necessary (starlings, ya know).

My next varmint scope will likely be a Bushnell 4200 Elite, or the Monarch, or the V24, depending on what I'm doing with it. For competition/varminting...I'm gonna try to avoid the temptation NOT to buy Leupold scopes.

One other of mine worth mentioning is the Weaver "T" series. It has a large following on the BR circuit as well.

I will never be in the market for a Tasco, BSA, Simmons, or any of the "low end" scopes, especially those or any others currently made in China.

Good luck.

P.
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
Thanks alot guys!!!

THanks for all the help guys! What do you guys think about Burris Signiture Rings? Kinda sounds like the way to go to me as this is the FIRST rifle i have ever put together!! Thanks again much appreciated!
 

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I love the Burris Signature Rings with the offset inserts! Very versatile and eliminate LOTS of headaches! Once you get used to putting them in and adjusting them to get the desired effect, you'll be hooked!
As far a scopes go I like the higher variable power ones. You won't be able to turn it up if you don't have it... if you have an 8-32 power you can always set it on 16X if thats what is needed.....Bushnell 4200 are nice, I've heard that there are a limited number of clicks on the Elite 8-32's... My friend has a 4-16 Bushnell Elite and it's super, got another bud with a Burris 6-24 and 8-32 and he's been pleased and I've looked thru them & they're nice as well.
I personally hunt groundhogs quite a bit, and on my table guns I use a 20-48x56 and a 18-40x50 boosted leupold and when I shoot at long ranges they're cranked up on the highest power 98% of the time. My carry guns and shooting stick rifles have 6.5-20x44 scopes on them and they usually stay on 20X, unless I'm in very low light conditions or heavy mirage then I will turn it down a little.
Hope this helps,welcome to the board & enjoy your new 204!!!Sam
 

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Welcome aboard, I am sure you will find a home here like the rest of us. Best of luck with your new rifle. I wish to echo the previous statements with regard to your choice of optics.
On my first prairie dog hunt, all of my rifles were equipped with Leupold 8.5-25x40mm scopes. Wonderful glass, but way too much to be staring through all day long.
Upon my return home, I sold/traded a few of those scopes for 4.5-14x40mm models of the same scope and I have been quite happy ever since. I did keep one of them for my Cooper in 22PPC which only sees time on the rifle range. For target work, the scope is terrific.
My favorite scope is a Leupold 4.5-14x40mm with side focus/30mm body and the Leupold Varmint Reticle. My second favorite is the Leupold M8 fixed 12x Varmint scope with a simple fine duplex reticle.
I also have used Weaver 4-16x varmint scopes and they are a pretty good lower cost alternative to a Leupold.
You can't go wrong with the Burris Signature Insert rings.
Ken
 

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Mil Dot vs Std Xhairs

If you have Krugerrands just laying around, consider a Digital Scope. It lets you program 4 different reticles and zero them for 4 ranges. Has 2.5 to 16.5X power, will record 10 sec. of video of your shot, sings, dances, and makes all it's own clothes. I have one and am a happy camper, also I have Leupold, Burris, Tasco, Redfield, Swift, blah, blah, blah. Elcan rules for P D's. "E"ail me with your addy, and I'll "E" mail back some of my shots ( 635 yd PD, Flippers ect ) OC
 
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