Considering a trade for a early Remington 700 in a+ shape chambered in .17 Remington. Any of you guys using this round? Thinking it might be a good yote and bobcat round. I really don't know anything about the .17 but hear they are great on fur and fairly accurate.
Leadbelly
love the 17 rem ! i've had 3 of them wish i had them all back .coyote kill'n sob's ! and will make a crow blow ! i got all kinds of load info 
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I've been checkin the 17 out also.
Saubier is a good site for all kinds of info for those itty bitty pill pushers.
The one thing I have recently read is the factory bbls MIGHT be aggravating for any type of sustained shooting, requiting cleaning 20-30 rds to keep from blowing jackets. Now before the rape and nape hit, I ain't making a blanket statement.......just the experiences of a few others.
From what I've found, IVY is a great cottage mfrd cleaning rod. It costs more but ......well, the usual applies - so I've read. I'll be ordering one or two for my 19 shortly. He has a dedicated tapered pointed jag set up that won't let the .002-3" mismatch snag on the crown when pulling back through.......I LIKE that design. It beats removing the jag after ea stroke and he makes them to your specified length. You'll find that info in a thread on Saubier that I started this week asking for suggestions. Same handle.
PS I don't remember what I read was the twist on a factory .17. It takes a 9 to stabilize the Kindler 30 Gold which is a high BC design. It shoots pretty flat - so I'm "told". It seems they are more or less the preferred pill when you can get'em. I called a few weeks back checking on some .20s and he didn't have any of either iirc.
An interesting round for sure. I'm leaning toward a .100 short PPC for a 17 in the backwaters of my mind. Right now, I have more ideas than $$. But what else is new?
Saubier is a good site for all kinds of info for those itty bitty pill pushers.
The one thing I have recently read is the factory bbls MIGHT be aggravating for any type of sustained shooting, requiting cleaning 20-30 rds to keep from blowing jackets. Now before the rape and nape hit, I ain't making a blanket statement.......just the experiences of a few others.
From what I've found, IVY is a great cottage mfrd cleaning rod. It costs more but ......well, the usual applies - so I've read. I'll be ordering one or two for my 19 shortly. He has a dedicated tapered pointed jag set up that won't let the .002-3" mismatch snag on the crown when pulling back through.......I LIKE that design. It beats removing the jag after ea stroke and he makes them to your specified length. You'll find that info in a thread on Saubier that I started this week asking for suggestions. Same handle.
PS I don't remember what I read was the twist on a factory .17. It takes a 9 to stabilize the Kindler 30 Gold which is a high BC design. It shoots pretty flat - so I'm "told". It seems they are more or less the preferred pill when you can get'em. I called a few weeks back checking on some .20s and he didn't have any of either iirc.
An interesting round for sure. I'm leaning toward a .100 short PPC for a 17 in the backwaters of my mind. Right now, I have more ideas than $$. But what else is new?
You'll love the 17 as a fur rifle. I had one years ago and the only thing that was any factor was the wind. 25gr. Light bullet. It was moving at close to a mile a second {4900??} so it didn't stay in the wind very long. One hole the size of a pin head in the fur. They're making a few differant sizes of bullets for it now.
Best thing for fur harvesters. Badgers to coyote, small entry, turns the insides to mush and seldom any exit. The old berger 25 [non-MEF] is my bullet of choice. I use an old Rem 700 I bought in 1971 and I have an Encore with a VVG stainless. The Rem is good for about 30 rds. before fouling opens groups, the VVG about 100 rds., your mileage may vary. Use Rem 7 1/2 primers, or CCI srm. Varget, Imr 4320 or RL7 are my powders of choice. They shoot flat and get the job done.
Thanks everybody, hopefully the rifle will be in good condition when I take a look at it in the morning. I was told it has hardly been fired and is in 99% condition. One last question, how has this round preformed on frontal chest shots on coyotes??? I've had my share of runners with the .22 hornet, triple deuce, and .223 rem. If possible I opt for a neck or head shot with these rounds. I expect the .17 Remington to preform similarly but would like to hear from first hand experience. My experince with runners might be more to do with the larger yotes we have in east ky, I've seen a lot of coyote hunting videos of folks in the west making frontal chest shots and getting DRT dogs.
Thanks again LB
Thanks again LB
Go For IT!
I have had 3 over the past way too long ago, and enjoyed developing a load tuned to the rifle. It's EASY to do, start w/ a known Accurate loading, right from the manual, and Taylor it from there! It is a Greatly accurate round, and once the Brass is Fireformed, spend the time to trick it fully out and then neck size it only and minimally too, as just enough to hold the Bullet!
My Load was complicated by MY choice of IMR 4064 as a Powder, and had to Drop Tube the Powder to fill the case as it's an Extruded powder. Mine Shot Best w/ 20 grainers, and I kept ranges for DRT Kills to 350, My Max, NOT the Rounds for DRT!
As stated, Use a Fiber Cleaning Rod, and Use it every score or so!
I used a Moly Bullet, Did them Myself, it was a Pain true, Yet I had no concerns ever! Wished I kept the First rifle, as I always compared the other 2 to it and Fellow VHA Area Coordinator Gary Lobe has it and won't consider selling it back to me, or anyone for that matter!!
Enjoy your new rifle and this AWESOME Little Pill!
I have had 3 over the past way too long ago, and enjoyed developing a load tuned to the rifle. It's EASY to do, start w/ a known Accurate loading, right from the manual, and Taylor it from there! It is a Greatly accurate round, and once the Brass is Fireformed, spend the time to trick it fully out and then neck size it only and minimally too, as just enough to hold the Bullet!
My Load was complicated by MY choice of IMR 4064 as a Powder, and had to Drop Tube the Powder to fill the case as it's an Extruded powder. Mine Shot Best w/ 20 grainers, and I kept ranges for DRT Kills to 350, My Max, NOT the Rounds for DRT!
As stated, Use a Fiber Cleaning Rod, and Use it every score or so!
I used a Moly Bullet, Did them Myself, it was a Pain true, Yet I had no concerns ever! Wished I kept the First rifle, as I always compared the other 2 to it and Fellow VHA Area Coordinator Gary Lobe has it and won't consider selling it back to me, or anyone for that matter!!
Enjoy your new rifle and this AWESOME Little
Pill!
Leadbelly
I had an opportunity about 3 years ago to get a 17 Rem BDL similar to what you're describing. A bunch of fellows on this board talked me into it and I'm glad they did. After using it one year, I sold my 223. I like the 17 Rem that well.
If it is a 9 twist it will shoot the 30gr Kindler golds. I really like that bullet for chucks. They are a bit pricey, but darned good. Beyond that the 25gr Vmax and 25gr hollow point from Hornady are also exceptional. Only bullets I had trouble with was the 25gr Bergers. About 3 out of 10 of them would go POOF about 15 feet in front of the muzzle.
Definitely use Rem 7 1/2 primers. Powder, RL-15 works well, ww760, and my favorite is H380. H380 is the easiest to work with for me and provides very good accuracy and speed.
The only downside is that cleaning is required about every 30-50 rounds with the stock barrel.
What to expect, it is quiet, hits are easy to see, kills are almost always instant, not a lot of pass through shots if hit in the boiler room. I've taken 12-15lb chucks out to 300yds and they are DRT. Go for it.... you'll like it. WD
I had an opportunity about 3 years ago to get a 17 Rem BDL similar to what you're describing. A bunch of fellows on this board talked me into it and I'm glad they did. After using it one year, I sold my 223. I like the 17 Rem that well.
If it is a 9 twist it will shoot the 30gr Kindler golds. I really like that bullet for chucks. They are a bit pricey, but darned good. Beyond that the 25gr Vmax and 25gr hollow point from Hornady are also exceptional. Only bullets I had trouble with was the 25gr Bergers. About 3 out of 10 of them would go POOF about 15 feet in front of the muzzle.
Definitely use Rem 7 1/2 primers. Powder, RL-15 works well, ww760, and my favorite is H380. H380 is the easiest to work with for me and provides very good accuracy and speed.
The only downside is that cleaning is required about every 30-50 rounds with the stock barrel.
What to expect, it is quiet, hits are easy to see, kills are almost always instant, not a lot of pass through shots if hit in the boiler room. I've taken 12-15lb chucks out to 300yds and they are DRT. Go for it.... you'll like it.
WD
ive killed alot of yotes with the 17rem ..IMO it will out preform the 223 on yotes if shots are keept under 200 yards.
When the 17 Remington was first introduced
my bullet of choice was the 25Gr VMax.
It would blow inside a water filled foam
coffee cup, w/o an exit. The factory ammo
loaded at 4,000 FPS was OK but not nearly
as impressive as the Hornady 25GR HP loaded at
the same speed. I killed 100s of GHs with
death being instantaneous
The 25GR VMax of today, has a thicker jacket,
and will not humanly kill a PD. The bullet in
most cases passes through.
For the 17 to be effective, the bullet must release
all of its energy inside the target.
Enjoy your rifle, its a fun caliber. LDS
my bullet of choice was the 25Gr VMax.
It would blow inside a water filled foam
coffee cup, w/o an exit. The factory ammo
loaded at 4,000 FPS was OK but not nearly
as impressive as the Hornady 25GR HP loaded at
the same speed. I killed 100s of GHs with
death being instantaneous
The 25GR VMax of today, has a thicker jacket,
and will not humanly kill a PD. The bullet in
most cases passes through.
For the 17 to be effective, the bullet must release
all of its energy inside the target.
Enjoy your rifle, its a fun caliber. LDS
Never had a 17 Rem, but do have the 17 Mach IV (adopted by Rem now as the 17 FB (.20 cal Fire Ball necked to .17).) Everything said about the 17 Rem could be applied to the smaller cousin up to 300 yards, perhaps. It is one of my favorite varmint calibers - no ricochet danger to speak of - a big plus for semi-rural PDs or pests on the "ranch". Crows... You'd think the SOBs had swallowed a golf ball of C4 explosive; a loud "POP" and a black cloud of feathers and that's it cept for feet and beaks!
I coat my bullets with 4 micron Tungsten disulphide (available from machine shop suppliers) and have no fouling issues, which some 17 Rem shooters have experienced. Accuracy - keeps 5 inside a dime from an TC and a 21" 10 twist bbl.
I can only imagine the 17 Rem would be all my Mk4 is and more!
I coat my bullets with 4 micron Tungsten disulphide (available from machine shop suppliers) and have no fouling issues, which some 17 Rem shooters have experienced. Accuracy - keeps 5 inside a dime from an TC and a 21" 10 twist bbl.
I can only imagine the 17 Rem would be all my Mk4 is and more!
First off, the 17 Remington is a great cartridge, IMO. You'll like it a bunch. The cartridge works great on coyote sized animals and the cartridge is just plain fun to shoot due to its very minimal recoil.
I saw the comment on it being quiet. None of the maybe 20 rifles I've owned in 17 Remington were quiet. The high velocity (in the 4K FPS range) creates a very loud and distinct crack when the rifle is fired. I have no idea what a 17 Remington with a muzzle velocity of 4900 fps as stated by one poster earlier would sound like, but I bet it would be REALLY loud.... I shoot at a public range sometimes and if I'm shooting a 17 Remington, I'm often asked what I'm shooting because those around me notice the loud noise. Smaller 17 cartridges are less loud, but the 17 Remington, in my opinion, is not quiet.
I have owned at least one rifle chambered for the cartridge since it was first introduced in 1971. Today I own four 17 Remington chambered rifles as well as a couple of custom 17 Mach IV rifles and a 17 Remington Fire Ball, which are for all intents and purposes, are the same cartridge (17 Mach IV/17 Rem FB) with only some minor dimensional variations. I also recently bought a rifle chambered in the new 17 Hornady Hornet which is much like my current 17 AH.
Last year I had the barrel on an old and fatigued 17-223 chambered rifle pulled to have a 17-222 rifle built, but as of today I have not finished the project due to a lack of current interest and doing other things.
If your BDL has anything but a 9" twist barrel, it is a very early 700 BDL/17 Remington combination. As mentioned earlier, the 17 Remington in the 700 BDL was first introduced in 1971 and it initially came with a 10" twist barrel.
By late 1973, IIRC, Remington had switched over to the 9" twist.
As a point of reference, I have a copy of the 1974 Speer Reloading Manual Number Nine that shows a 9" twist Rem 700 BDL as the rifle used to build the load data on the 17 Remington loading page. Speer never made a 17 caliber bullet but none the less in their manual they showed load data for a 25 grain HP (presumably Hornady) in the 17 Remington cartridge.
Also, in the back of the 1974 dated manual there is a reference section titled "Rifling Twist Used In Modern Center Fire Rifles" showing the current (1974 in this case) barrel twist by caliber/cartridge and rifle maker. For the 17 Remington, the chart shows:
17 Remington
1 in 9"
Remington 700
As for the Hornady 25 grain 17 caliber V-Max bullet being used in early 17 Remington rifles, Hornady V-Max bullets were first introduced in 1993 which is when the first 17 caliber V-Max was introduced. That is 22 years after the 17 Remington was introduced.
Initially the only available factory bullets for the 17 Remington were a 25 grain HP from Hornady, which is still being produced, and for quite a few years until maybe into the late 1980’s, Remington made their own 25 grain HP bullet which they used for loaded ammunition and which they also sold as a reloading component. It was a good bullet and it typically performed better than the Hornady HP on coyotes as far as fur damage was concerned with "I hit him around the fringe" shots. Berger also chipped in with several 17 caliber bullets in later years but I don't remember when it was as none of them shot as well as other bullets I had available.
On the barrel fouling issue, if your rifle is an older model 700, there is a good chance the barrel will shoot well and be easy to clean. Some early barrels did indeed foul easily due to poor barrel making technology at the time, but some were exceptionally accurate and cleaned easily even back then. Typically - For hunting purposes, I rarely clean a 17 Remington barrel before 100 rounds have been fired.
Still - Each barrel is unique and a 17 will tell you when cleaning is needed, either by noticeably reduced accuracy or by the small 17 caliber bullets key-holing on targets at 100 yards due to excessive copper fouling.
I've never seen the 17 Remington as a BR round so I've never tried shooting "internet impressive" groups with any of mine over a bench or over a keyboard. Still, it is an accurate round, and sub-MOA accuracy is normal.
For powders, several good options have been mentioned, and over the years I have tried a bunch of different ones. Through it all, I keep coming back to IMR 4198 as an excellent powder for the 17 Remington. I've never seen a 17 Remington chambered rifle that did not like it in terms of accuracy, and no coyote can out run a 25 grain 17 caliber bullet pushed by just over 19 grains of it. IMR 4230 has also performed very well for me.
Use only a primer like the Rem 7 1/2 or the CCI BR4 which both have a thicker cup as small bore cartridges such as the 17 Remington develop peak breech pressure very quickly, and lesser primers will burn through at times. Max breech pressure is not that great (52,000CUP, IIRC), but it comes very quickly in small bore cartridges. This quick rise in pressure comes about accompanied by intense heat that some lesser primers can't handle in all rifles.
Again, I'm betting you'll like the rifle for a lot of reasons.
-BCB
Edited to add: I've never shot a single coated bullet in any 17 caliber rifle I've owned.
I saw the comment on it being quiet. None of the maybe 20 rifles I've owned in 17 Remington were quiet. The high velocity (in the 4K FPS range) creates a very loud and distinct crack when the rifle is fired. I have no idea what a 17 Remington with a muzzle velocity of 4900 fps as stated by one poster earlier would sound like, but I bet it would be REALLY loud.... I shoot at a public range sometimes and if I'm shooting a 17 Remington, I'm often asked what I'm shooting because those around me notice the loud noise. Smaller 17 cartridges are less loud, but the 17 Remington, in my opinion, is not quiet.
I have owned at least one rifle chambered for the cartridge since it was first introduced in 1971. Today I own four 17 Remington chambered rifles as well as a couple of custom 17 Mach IV rifles and a 17 Remington Fire Ball, which are for all intents and purposes, are the same cartridge (17 Mach IV/17 Rem FB) with only some minor dimensional variations. I also recently bought a rifle chambered in the new 17 Hornady Hornet which is much like my current 17 AH.
Last year I had the barrel on an old and fatigued 17-223 chambered rifle pulled to have a 17-222 rifle built, but as of today I have not finished the project due to a lack of current interest and doing other things.
If your BDL has anything but a 9" twist barrel, it is a very early 700 BDL/17 Remington combination. As mentioned earlier, the 17 Remington in the 700 BDL was first introduced in 1971 and it initially came with a 10" twist barrel.
By late 1973, IIRC, Remington had switched over to the 9" twist.
As a point of reference, I have a copy of the 1974 Speer Reloading Manual Number Nine that shows a 9" twist Rem 700 BDL as the rifle used to build the load data on the 17 Remington loading page. Speer never made a 17 caliber bullet but none the less in their manual they showed load data for a 25 grain HP (presumably Hornady) in the 17 Remington cartridge.
Also, in the back of the 1974 dated manual there is a reference section titled "Rifling Twist Used In Modern Center Fire Rifles" showing the current (1974 in this case) barrel twist by caliber/cartridge and rifle maker. For the 17 Remington, the chart shows:
17 Remington
1 in 9"
Remington 700
As for the Hornady 25 grain 17 caliber V-Max bullet being used in early 17 Remington rifles, Hornady V-Max bullets were first introduced in 1993 which is when the first 17 caliber V-Max was introduced. That is 22 years after the 17 Remington was introduced.
Initially the only available factory bullets for the 17 Remington were a 25 grain HP from Hornady, which is still being produced, and for quite a few years until maybe into the late 1980’s, Remington made their own 25 grain HP bullet which they used for loaded ammunition and which they also sold as a reloading component. It was a good bullet and it typically performed better than the Hornady HP on coyotes as far as fur damage was concerned with "I hit him around the fringe" shots. Berger also chipped in with several 17 caliber bullets in later years but I don't remember when it was as none of them shot as well as other bullets I had available.
On the barrel fouling issue, if your rifle is an older model 700, there is a good chance the barrel will shoot well and be easy to clean. Some early barrels did indeed foul easily due to poor barrel making technology at the time, but some were exceptionally accurate and cleaned easily even back then. Typically - For hunting purposes, I rarely clean a 17 Remington barrel before 100 rounds have been fired.
Still - Each barrel is unique and a 17 will tell you when cleaning is needed, either by noticeably reduced accuracy or by the small 17 caliber bullets key-holing on targets at 100 yards due to excessive copper fouling.
I've never seen the 17 Remington as a BR round so I've never tried shooting "internet impressive" groups with any of mine over a bench or over a keyboard. Still, it is an accurate round, and sub-MOA accuracy is normal.
For powders, several good options have been mentioned, and over the years I have tried a bunch of different ones. Through it all, I keep coming back to IMR 4198 as an excellent powder for the 17 Remington. I've never seen a 17 Remington chambered rifle that did not like it in terms of accuracy, and no coyote can out run a 25 grain 17 caliber bullet pushed by just over 19 grains of it. IMR 4230 has also performed very well for me.
Use only a primer like the Rem 7 1/2 or the CCI BR4 which both have a thicker cup as small bore cartridges such as the 17 Remington develop peak breech pressure very quickly, and lesser primers will burn through at times. Max breech pressure is not that great (52,000CUP, IIRC), but it comes very quickly in small bore cartridges. This quick rise in pressure comes about accompanied by intense heat that some lesser primers can't handle in all rifles.
Again, I'm betting you'll like the rifle for a lot of reasons.
-BCB
Edited to add: I've never shot a single coated bullet in any 17 caliber rifle I've owned.
Well, did you get it yet ??? LOL
They really surprized me when my daughter got hers [Thanks to Murph]
She killed her first yote at the 3C's shoot in Ga. 200yrds and it was DRT. Hit it in the ribs and it hit the ground. We've tried the 25 and 30 gr bergers and they seemed to shoot better than the lighter bullets we've tried.
I think you'll like it on yotes and anything smaller.
Donnie
They really surprized me when my daughter got hers [Thanks to Murph]
She killed her first yote at the 3C's shoot in Ga. 200yrds and it was DRT. Hit it in the ribs and it hit the ground. We've tried the 25 and 30 gr bergers and they seemed to shoot better than the lighter bullets we've tried.
I think you'll like it on yotes and anything smaller.
Donnie
I like the Berger 30's in mine. The best powder and load I've found, by far, is XMR 4064.
23.7 grains in my Rem. 700 gives me sub-3/4" groups and 3800 fps. Kills coyotes like a death ray. But, if you hit them around the edges, it will still tear up a pelt. The trajectory is virtually identical to my 22-250 with 55's.
Jim
23.7 grains in my Rem. 700 gives me sub-3/4" groups and 3800 fps. Kills coyotes like a death ray. But, if you hit them around the edges, it will still tear up a pelt. The trajectory is virtually identical to my 22-250 with 55's.
Jim
Well picked it up this afternoon. It's a really nice rifle dosent look like its been used much at all. The barrel does have a lot of copper built up but the owner said its only had around 40 shots run down it since it was purchased. I will shoot it tomorrow without cleaning( if deer hunting is slow) to see how it does. The only thing I didn't like about the gun is the BSA scope that's mounted to it. Got a spare redfield at the house I'm going to mount later. Now I gotta get a .17 cal drop tube for my redding measure, Dewey cleaning rod, brushes and jags. Brass and bullets redding bushing neck die and forester seater.
Thanks LB
Thanks LB
Thanks BCB,
Not planning on any high volume shooting with the .17rem, so hand weighing ain't a big deal. I've been looking for bullets and it seems hornady has stopped production of the 25gr hp temporarily, how is the Availibility of the 30gr kindlers? Seems my gun does have a 1 in 9 twist so those slugs should stabilize.
Thanks LB
Not planning on any high volume shooting with the .17rem, so hand weighing ain't a big deal. I've been looking for bullets and it seems hornady has stopped production of the 25gr hp temporarily, how is the Availibility of the 30gr kindlers? Seems my gun does have a 1 in 9 twist so those slugs should stabilize.
Thanks LB
I've never had any problems with the availability on the Kindlers.
If you can't find any bullets let me know and I'll recheck my inventory. WD
If you can't find any bullets let me know and I'll recheck my inventory.
WD-
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